The design is wonderful, but at 65 tall, I think I will have to give it a miss. I think Im not in a hurry to book or get an upgrade to PE with these seats in the near future. Leaving aside the economics, I know where I would rather be. David, there seems to be inconsistency in the website in that sometimes I can see comments on my browser (i.e. It's an absolute con as there's little evidence that one will 'sleep' any better than in much cheaper cattle class Y. No way will I risk that ever again..so disappointed to hear this on the Dreamlinersuppose I'm dreaming to think they could make seats for tall& some for short ? The business revolution on the 787 seams lacking. Here are the best watches of the year: should you care? I know it is ausBT policy to rarely review and venture past row 35 in to the Y cabin however it would be interesting to hear how tight it is back there in the infamous 787 3-3-3 configuration! One of the best-designed premium economy cabins has rolled out on Cathay Pacific's A350s, while its B777-300ERs are . but a much nicer seat to sleep in than economy. I The Premium Economy seating on the Qantas 787 is a huge step down from their retiring 747 fleet. And if you're in the middle seat in the centre block of Qantas' 2-3-2 premium economy cabin, I'd expect the process of extracting yourself when the seat in front of you is reclined is going to demand a degree of double-jointedness. This is a high-powered 2A port pumping out plenty of juice to fully recharge your travel tech, while the location is ideal for charging up your smartphone, tablet or eBook reader while also using the device. But my point is comments like "I actually slept worse in the JQ J seat on the 788 than I normally do in the QF Y seat on the 333/332." . Premium Economy Classic Flight Rewards on the Perth-Rome route. First of all the Qantas Dreamliner Premium economy cabin is an excellent size with just 4 rows and 28 seats. I'm about 180cm and had plenty of legroom. I pay no attention to any review where the pax flew 'courtesy of'. The added recline, whilst sounding initially attractive, actually becomes part of the problem. What I tend to do is when available, I assess by seat product specs and hopefully, some clear photos/diagrams revealing the product fm all angles and all available adjustment config/setting. I've personally found PE not comfortable, once again that's just me, hence saying ironic that I'd prefer economy. Bob I presume spoken by one who was on the delivery flight! Contrast this with, say, advanced railway design of the 1950s where 'The Overland' train between Adelaide and Melbourne had first class seats (for those who didn't book a sleeper) with a proper supportive, reclining seat extender in first, and the ability to stretch out over two seats in both first and economy seats, something that airlines cannot achieve with today's PE (although the latter must minimise weight.) https://www.businesstrave. The calf-rest swings down from the rear of the seat, revealing the netting cradle. Already have an ET account? TPG premium economy reviews range from "business class in all but the seat" to "economy at twice the price." Individual airlines define premium economy very differently. I'd suggest Qantas will look to purchase bandwidth on the ViaSat network for international flights, and that's still being built out ViaSat 2 launched mid-year and the much faster ViaSat 3 series will launch from 2019/2020. Our route from SFO to Australia tonight on QF50 - a bit more over-water flying than I'm comfortable with if I'm . 1 . Singapore Airlines is a powerful name in the skies, but it's also hitting review lists as one of the best premium economy airlines for good reason. Part of the issue as noted in the article is that SQ premium doesn't recline as far. United Boeing 787 Economy Class. hope QF looks at this issue and removes a row to create extra space. When even scoot could factory fit WiFi to their budget 787 aircraft there really is no excuse for Qantas and their super long haul 17hr flight aircraft not to have it. . 5. Apparently, the concept of design trade-offs is unknown for many here. "this is an Australian traveller website, where we focus on our Airlines". As part of "Project Sunrise," the Australian flag carrier will launch nonstop flights from . Readers who have been followingAustralian Business Travellersince the early days will recallwe noted a similar problemwith Air New Zealand's 2011 launch of its own 'revolutionary'premium economy Spaceseat(below) on theBoeing 777-300ER. However, row 20 is also where the baby bassinets are fitted there's one in front of 20A/B and another ahead of 20J/K, so when choosing the outer pairs, there's always a chance you could be moved to accommodate a child. third The best premium economy seats on the Qantas Boeing 787. Check and compare which airlines provide the best premium economy cabin rated by travelers in the global airline passenger satisfaction survey. Responding to a wave of criticism, Air New Zealand quicklyremoved an entire row of seatsfrom the premium economy cabin to deliver between four and six extra inches of legroom for each passenger. Not me as the design trade offs are obvious and 38inches seat pitch was not revealed by QF only yesterday.the deep recline capability was kinda news though. " Young Mr Caon can't do a thing with it. It's a far more costly PY design specs than many folks imagined for NZ to go 41" instead of the typical 38" like QF even if no diff in seat construction cost. Sorry QF, it's a big thumbs down! I booked PE on the inaugural flight to LAX before seeing this product (note to self, don't trust QF's understanding of the term "revolutionary") and now I'm a little less excited about the flight. THE BEST OF PREMIUM ECONOMY CLASS: Air New Zealand's premium economy seat on a Boeing 777. . These are necessary as they fly some of the longest routes in the world. It works on hydraulics and can be set into a wide range of positions, typically to support your calves while your feet slide into their own hammock. The Air France PE suffers the same fate as the Air NZ Spaceseat. I think you're over thinking this, In business class I sleep better setting the seat to a recline position instead of fully flat, that's just me. I think removing a row of premium economy seats is going to be troublesome for the finely-calculated economics of the Qantas Dreamliner. Published on January 31, 2017. All economy seats on Qantas 737-800 are a disgrace. There's a smaller cabin of five rows ahead of the emergency exit row and bathrooms with another 14 rows of economy behind that. The joy of the . Qantas PE and F classes are a total waste of money it seems. Can 't say as I haven't flown in that BA product. Obviously not up to business, but enough Penny pinching to say the least. Well, we put it to the ultimate test on the extremely popular 16-hour non-stop flight from London to Perth. Maximum 24inch width available per section. "SQ premium economy also 38". That's ok if NZ can consistently earn 7.7% higher PY fare than QF on similar 787 sectorsa shaky assumption in the real PY consumer mkt. One of the excellent airplanes in its possession is Boeing which managed to build a name in the Courses 104 View detail Preview site Our flight was on Monday, September 9 and our seats were 23D and E - aisle and centre - at the back of the zone. I sleep better in economy with no leg rest. "look at the pics and review above, its clear cut.". Caon has added several other passenger-friendly touches. Here's a shot of this in situ on the Boeing 787-9 and a clearer snap from the seat's launch earlier this year, which illustrates the difference once the seat reclines. I value legroom more than seat width so I'd rather just stick to Y and pay for an exit row seat - it would be a lot cheaper as well! The Qantas Premium Economy seat reclines up to a generous 9 inches, which is great for the person reclining. For couples and duos the A+B and J+K pairs: When travelling with a partner or friend, there's no reason to have a seatmate in the centre group when you can instead sit together by the windows! Login now. Find the best seat wiht our Qantas Boeing 787-9 (789) seating chart. I actually slept worse in the JQ J seat on the 788 than I normally do in the QF Y seat on the 333/332. While other facts apparently can be overlooked in a heart beat by so many folks here. Well send you an email containing the activation link. Very thorough and impartial article - great to see. PER-LHR experiment will be a failure. Allowing for this extra space between the edge of the cushion and the inner wall of the armrests brings the total of what could be called hip width to 22.8 inches (58cm). parties. Other perks include dedicated check-in, priority boarding, an amenity kit and upgraded dining. Qantas says its next-generation premium economy seat will retain a 'cradle' design to help passengers relax and sleep on those 18-20+ hour Project Sunrise flights to London, New York, Paris and potentially Chicago and Miami.. They'll also have more legroom than the current Boeing 787 and Airbus A380 premium economy pews, with an extra two inches of pitch - 40" as opposed to 38 . Resend one to yourself here. Will be interesting to see comments once people start using the seat, "Can't help but think FLX1 is a Qantas troll". Laptop Power Ports. Wouldn't be surprised if they remove a row of seats like Air NZ did, the foot rest looks weird and bafiling. QF31 - Sydney to London via Singapore (SYD-SIN-LHR) 9 June 2009. Correct me if I'm wrong. Pity that Qantas decided to go middle of the road in regard to the important issue of space that could never be called revolutionary. Qantas rolled out new seat products across all three classes for its 787-9 Dreamliner - business, premium economy and economy. 30" pitch is horrific. Whilst the J class product on the QF 789 maybe the equal of any airline flying the type, it is fair to say that the W seat is not in the same category. The original concept was developed by Thompson Aero Seating the same firm behind the Boeing 787sbusiness class seat and brought into the real world by David Caon. Qantas has introduced an all-new premium economy seat for the 787 and increased the number of seats available for this popular class. David also looks extremely well dressed, with a tie, as male business travellers ought have except in tropical climates. While it is 38 inches which matches up with most competitors with only a few exceptions, the seat recline reduces legroom significantly. This pitch is an inch longer than that of its competitors, though the seat is narrower by 0.3 inches and a 6-inch recline makes for a comfortable flight as well. It will be a good idea to get Mr Qantas CEO & his mates to do a 14 hour flight in PE and see how they pull up!!!!! One member, having flown from Melbourne to Los Angeles, believes this is the best Economy seat in the Qantas fleet. This configuration seats a total of 484 passengers: 14 First class suites, 64 fully-flat Business class skybeds, 35 Premium Economy seats and 371 Economy seats. David Flynn travelled on the Qantas Boeing 787-9 Dreamliner delivery flight from Seattle to Sydney as a guest of Qantas. Hi RealKid,Our diagrams are taken from the official Qantas Boeing 787 LOPA (Layout of Passenger Accommodations) - an internal Qantas document which was shared with us exclusively. Your seat. Qantas Airways. Flying to Australia from London or any European city is no easy feat, and choosing the right airline is just one part of the puzzle. I'll keep an open mind and give it a go sometime. The modern Business suites on Qantas' Boeing 787-9 Dreamliners are similar to the seats found on the A380. Qantas has unveiled a new business-class seat as it prepares to launch the world's longest flights. The over-sized winged headrest has plenty of vertical adjustment to suit passengers of almost any height, and a thick custom pillow more like a bolster in some ways slides over the headrest for added comfort (especially when it's nap-time), an arrangement which also prevents the pillow from sliding around and slipping down behind your back. But that's the point David and I were making, rather than setting the seat to flat we prefer setting it to a recliner position for sleep. FLX, I understand, however looking back through the comments you have personally replied to approx 8 different people comments on this topic that appear to be negative, I find that interesting that someone would take the time to constantly reply to multiple posts on a topic. The most recent remote connection with QF Group was my JetStar Pacific sector PQC->SGN earlier this mth. Credit to AirNZ for the way it acted so promptly in fixing its premium economy legroom issues, however AirNZ's Boeing 777-300ER premium economy Spaceseat cabin was almost twice the size of the Qantas Boeing 787-9's premium economy cabin. The best options for optimal hydration . Which I find even more ironic because all known PY and J designs in service today worldwide hv a wide range of recline angle and obviously can be adjusted to a setting that exactly mirrors what is possible with a Y seat. The pairs of seats along the windows are the best choice, offering a more premium feel and better privacy. Also read: AusBT reviews the Qantas Boeing 787-9 Dreamliner business class seat. Key facts: Qantas 787 Economy seats. The lack of any toilets in the PE cabin was also a tad inconvenient. 17 hours on the London route via Perth with QF? An interesting review! Well send you an email to re-activate your account and enter a new password. If you can book these seats ignore business. Qantas can't even "afford" to do that for their Premium Economy product? Most of all, one huge flaw with the typical seven across premium economy seat design is that because of the way the seats and accompanying tables and other equipment are designed, if the seat next to you is vacant, you cannot stretch out into both seats. This premium economy seat and Qantas' premium economy passengers on the Boeing 787-9 deserve better. . Austrian's B777-200 aircraft hold a total of 24 premium economy seats configured 2-4-2, while B767-300ERs contain 30 seats (expanded from 18) configured 2-2-2. And once the passenger in front of you reclines their seat, things get very tight. Sincerely hope the A380 refit doesn't go the same way. There are 21 seats total in the three-row cabin, divided from economy class with a bulkhead and business class with a galley and lavatories. The Air NZ space seats replacement are great for sleeping, and at 41'' they still have good personal space. Also, SQ is a 100% international airline for obvious reasons.Qantas on the other hand is as much a domestic airline as an international one, perhaps even more so, and it's chosen to outfit its domestic fleet first, for obvious reasons that it will help QF stay ahead in the two-horse race against Virgin, while international is already a very broad field where WiFi won't add as much advantage, so QF's contracts for satellite provider are for Australian coverage (via the NBN satellite), it doesn't have any agreement with an international satellite provider. Any ideas? "QF 787 PE is set at 38 with some significant reductions wth seat recline through the design.". Qantas magazine; Inflight Dining; Domestic and Regional dining; Trans-Tasman dining; International dining; Dietary required meals; Seat maps; Boeing 787-9; Airbus 380; Airbus 330-300; Airbus 330-200 . The seat pitch which approximates as an indicator of legroom, being a measure of the distance between your seat back and that of the seat in front of you, representing the room that's "yours" during the flight is 38 inches. Best Premium Economy Class Airline Seats 2022. Seating is mostly in a 3-3-3 arrangement, except in the final row where it tapers to 2-3-2: Divided across two sections, the smaller front cabin takes rows 40-44 while the larger main cabin seats rows 46 through 59, skipping row 45. I have used SQ premium economy, while nice, compared with standard economy, I prefer the QF product. Each seat has a 13.3 inch video screen with those fitted to the armrests of the front-row seats showcasing how narrow today's video screens have become. ANA All Nippon Airways. The ergonomically designed headrest can be fitted with a specially designed pillow . Share this article: Nestled between business class and economy, the Qantas Boeing 787 boasts a cosy premium economy zone of just 28 travellers seated across four rows (numbered 20 through 23): The cabin comes in a 2-3-2 layout, with the paired window seats listed as A/B and J/K and the centre trio as D/E/F. One point below is premium economy onboard Japan Airlines 787-9 Dreamliner . Along with 38 . Generally a fan of the seats Qantas designs (and they are thoughtfully done), but their very tight configurations (especially on jets that don't need it [A380]) really undermines the designs. Hi Chris, Where have you sourced these seatmaps which are used in the article? Andy: it's actually not too bad, naturally gets less so once the seat in front reclines will be posting a photo gallery/review of the economy seats when we can, but might not be until next week Great review and definitely what I thought about the leg room situation. Which really doesn't matter because folks here attack this QF PY seat design purely on the basis of knee room and totally forgot that seat pitch contains a space for both recline AND knee room. Find cheap flights with Qantas. May be SQ is considered an Australian airline.. With mathematical/physical certainty, I think it's clear which of the following yields a wider seat or aisle width in PY: Distribute 8seats +2aisles across a cabin diameter of 221inches. Quite disappointing. The new seats are not much better than a Coach seat, with restricted leg room, less available recline, and an almost useless footrest. Pitch 32". As for the "perception", I think some negativity is due to the "revolutionary" hype and the disappointment that Qantas could have had something really special here if only they'd gone with a couple of extra inches in legroom. Qantas. Which is ironic when the same group applies equal dose of focus on the product superiority @ SQ on the same website comment section. On nearly every aircraft, there are seats in the forward-most part of the plane, facing the wall at the entry door and forward galley. I don't know about U but I personally never ever take the PR descriptive such as "revolutionary" or "streets ahead of" fm any vendor without a heavy grain of salt. In one search for flights from LAX to London, an economy ticket cost $2,288 for a refundable fare or 30,000 miles for a valuation of 7.6 cents per mile. . In addition to a great seat, Qantas's premium economy benefits range from complimentary noise canceling headphones, enhanced bedding, Rockpool pre ordered meals, and priority ground services. 7. Otherwise how would you know! Singapore Airlines offers Premium Economy seats on several long-haul flights to most European, US, and even APAC destinations and on the flagship ultra-long-haul flight to Newark in New York, the world's longest flight before Qantas starts to commercialise the flight to London.. Great idea for short people. Premium Economy: Seat Recline. Funny you say that, I've flown PE on Qantas and Cathay and found I couldn't get my legs in a comfortable position which hindered sleep. However, as with many radical solutions, this one will baffle the punters and rely heavily on Qantas cabin crew and the 'introducing your seat' video on the inflight entertainment system explaining to passengers how it all works. We first raised this in our detailed preview of the seats published in February 2017, and last week's launch of the Qantas Boeing 787-9 and its subsequent delivery flight from Seattle to Sydney during which we spent some hours sleeping in the premium economy seat brings this into sharper focus. But there's a trick to using this: the narrow L-shaped frame needs to be pulled out from the bottom-left corner of the screen for maximum grip, not from the middle as most people would expect. Premium economy cabin. Width 17.2". This Hong Kong-based oneworld partner offers Premium Economy on all of its flights to and from Australia. 20. While most people would likely prefer to travel in first or business, the nonstop flights will also offer 40 premium economy seats and 140 seats in regular economy. It's hard to escape the conclusion that 38 inches simply isn't enough, and that at least 40 inches would be more appropriate as this would deliver upwards of an extra two inches (5cm) at the knees. Great article with lots of detail.It demonstrates that, once again, Qantas took a great hard product (a well-designed seat with lots of terrific features) and rendered it distinctly sub-standard by squeezing them too close together. Qantas would be extremely concerned that someone like David Flynn, in a well thought out review with numerous photos has found fault with the design. Airline footrests are either too flimsy, or don't stay up at the correct level. The large pocket on the rear of each seat is perfect for tucking away magazines or your laptop when not in use. The new seats are not much better than a Coach seat, with restricted leg room, less . Hate to say it but even American Airlines offers inseat power in each economy seat on their 787's, well at least in main cabin extra. If youve forgotten your password, simply enter your email address Question.can I book two economy seats for myself!?? Cabin manager said QF are giving premium customers a a chance to "check out the PE seats" whilst the 787 is doing the the PER-MEL-PER runs. When the premium economy seat tilts back into a generous 9.5 inch recline (a smidge more than on the Qantas A380 superjumbo), the base of the seat angles up and moves forward. Nov 10, 2019, 6:03 AM. The seat. And premium I just can't get as comfortable as economy which is ironic.". Economy vs. (The Kiwi carrier eventually ditched the radical Spaceseat design in favour of the more conventional seat flown on its own Boeing 787-9 Dreamliners.). Premium economy is a work in progress, and you may get caught up mid-transition. Im flying that on the inaugural QF9 mar24 and certainly confirms my initial thoughts of the publicity shots that it is tighter for legroom than I would expect. Looks uncomfortable alright, that legroom is inadequate I struggle to think how they can call this premium economy, more like modified economy. Qantas has touted its Premium Economy seat on its Boeing 787s as the world's best. There's nothing to communicate either of these points to passengers. The seatback screens can be angled up to face you when the person in front reclines their seat. Indeed, if you leave your tablet sitting in the middle of the frame again, a natural assumption the small grip area is insufficient to hold the tablet, which then does an Olympic-grade tumble dive into your hands. This is not business class!! In-flight entertainment: In-seat Panasonic entertainment screens (newest generation) Best seats: Rows 40 or 46. On 28th November, I flew Qantas Dreamliner from Darwin to Sydney. Seat 9 is worse than a bad seat. Not sure any airline, QF included are too keen to resolve the issue. This all comes back to pitch, to the distance between the seats. The small size of the cabin adds to the exclusive feel of flying premium economy . Not a big fan of the new Business seat either. The Business Suites and Premium Economy seats featured on the Dreamliner are being installed on the airline's Airbus A380 fleet as part of an upgrade of its largest long-range aircraft. Solo travellers will also prefer the window seats here to avoid being awoken during the flight when their seatmate needs to hop up. Any indication that QF are aware of the situation? Sign up to our twice weekly newsletter to get the latest premium travel news, exclusives and inspiration right to your inbox. "If you make PE too good your not going to pay for business.". Here's the side-on view with a front seat reclined: Note the leg position of the passenger in the rear seat: I'm in the shot below, and despite being bog-average in height you can still see how my legs are close to the rear of the seat without even the room to cross them. Sorry to disappoint U but I hv no connection with QF. Talking point: have you given up on airport WiFi? There seems to be a lot of grumbling in these responses but my read of it is that it is much the same as the A380 seat with a few improvements. Connect with other business travellers in our, Review: Westpac Altitude Qantas Black Mastercard credit card, Up close with Lufthansas new Allegris business class, Lufthansas new first class features double beds, Jumbo upgrade: Lufthansa 747s to get Allegris first, business class, Australian passports now work with e-gates at Kuala Lumpur, 5 reasons you shouldn't bin your boarding passes, What to do when an airline cancels your flight, New ways for airlines to win your business, Australia's airport mask mandate will soon come to an end. premium price for the privelege, although while this may have needed a flight from Seattle to realise, in the literal sense of the word, it was obvious right from the start that young Mr Caon had got it wrong.Together with the comments add to the impression that PE is a class too many in the small aircraft which is the B787, and that JAL has done it right in regard to the aircraft it has configured for flights to/from Australia. I'm not desperately citing anything except my personal experience, I'm not telling anyone they should or would experience the same as I do. :), I bet the premium economy seats will be angled lie flat beds as a form of revolutionary premium economy. The newest product is on the Airbus A350. It does appear the economics of the 787 aren't quite as brilliant as Boeing may have initially indicated and seem to rely on a very tight Y class configuration, a sub-optimal W class configuration and less lavs than is ideal. SQ premium economy also 38". Seat Type: Standard Recliner. Qantas is already moving to 'Gen2' kit for its domestic 737s, ands that trial's been running for not even a year. Qantas Boeing 787 Seat Map - Updated 2023. David, in photo 16 (and shown in photo 17 with your writing notebook), does that side space have something at the bottom of the seat to ensure that whatever you put there, stays there (without slipping down into the bowels of the seat, necessitating a call to an FA)? But I have yet to see a PE seat that retains the sense of space and comfort. The entire aircraft has in seat power at every seat. G'DAY OWFsquad and welcome to my 32nd flight in 2020! I always slept like a baby on this train in first class, aided by less intrusive lighting (blue night lights) compared to the annoying bright white light seepage from the galley or toilet areas, or the yellow 'seatbelt sign' lights on most aircraft. And the tablet then needs to be slid all the way over to the left to be 'docked' into the corner of the frame. Ok, apart from the hammock thing it's no advance over something like the prev gen PE seating on EVA - Which at it's height had 40" pitch (reduced to 38 when they reconfigured the J cabin), same pivot-cradle style seat but executed better - with leg-rest, and seat dropped into it's own space when reclined, minimising the space encroachment on the passenger behind. New business-class seat as it prepares to launch the world & # x27 ; longest. Large pocket on the A380 and review above, its clear cut. `` a password! Necessary as they fly some of the road in regard to the ultimate test on the 333/332 would. Hope QF looks at this issue and removes a row of premium economy is a work in progress, you. Tie, as male business travellers ought have except in tropical climates seat wiht our Qantas Boeing.... Password, simply enter your email address Question.can I book two economy seats on Qantas & # x27 s... 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Troublesome for the finely-calculated economics of the new business seat either the sense of space comfort! Called revolutionary upgraded dining the 788 than I normally do in the website in that sometimes I can comments. Row of seats like Air NZ did, the seat recline through the is... Is wonderful, but enough Penny pinching to say the least that BA product premium feel better. A PE seat that retains the sense of space and comfort road in regard to the distance between the found! Thorough and impartial article - great to see a PE seat that retains the of!
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